tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post115505749452375048..comments2023-10-11T10:40:48.712-04:00Comments on The Miserable Annals of the Earth: Manly, yesDoc Nebulahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13052810933464744998noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155789224672246402006-08-17T00:33:00.000-04:002006-08-17T00:33:00.000-04:00Yeah, I know. But... it just seems wrong somehow....Yeah, I know. But... it just seems wrong somehow.<BR/><BR/>Eh, like I said, out of my league.Natehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04492265703592804987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155515764258714842006-08-13T20:36:00.000-04:002006-08-13T20:36:00.000-04:00Nate,You are, once again, missing the point I keep...Nate,<BR/><BR/>You are, once again, missing the point I keep making... 'manly' isn't a positive thing, at least, as I understand it, in which it basically means, being a strutting, machismo-obsessed, testosterone poisoned blowhard.<BR/><BR/>If you look a few entries up on my main page, you'll find I've gone in and revisited this, at length. Supes still didn't make the list, but I addressed why in more detail.Doc Nebulahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13052810933464744998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155511354430571562006-08-13T19:22:00.000-04:002006-08-13T19:22:00.000-04:00(Squints eyes in disagreement)Mmm, I dunno... some...(Squints eyes in disagreement)<BR/><BR/>Mmm, I dunno... someone's equivocating here then. That's a really shoddy definition of 'manly'.<BR/><BR/>But under that definition, well, I guess Supes is off the list... but there ought to be some serious fine print backing that up.<BR/><BR/>He uses the Sun for a dry-cleaner, dammit! Who can top that?! Who?!Natehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04492265703592804987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155221407643001552006-08-10T10:50:00.000-04:002006-08-10T10:50:00.000-04:00H...yeah, I get your point. I've seen a few guys w...H...yeah, I get your point. I've seen a few guys who could be classified as walking masses of moss and rotting vegetation, I guess I couldn't really call that manly. A manly aroma, yes, but that's about it.Laurie Borishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08361627047571650547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155202499107441412006-08-10T05:34:00.000-04:002006-08-10T05:34:00.000-04:00Aaa,Again, it's important to remember, being 'manl...Aaa,<BR/><BR/>Again, it's important to remember, being 'manly' isn't necessarily a good thing, and winding up on the same list as contains Punisher and Wolverine isn't necessarily a compliment. Superman has never behaved like a macho jerk... or if he has, he's never done it with the swagger and stupidity of Batman, Captain America, or any of these others.<BR/><BR/>The more I think about it, the more I believe that I should probably take Cap off the list and put USAgent in his stead. Cap's very reasonable, too... at least, for a super icon living in a universe where it's considered to be the height of reason to settle every disagreement with another man, no matter how minor, with your fists.<BR/><BR/>It's also important to understand that Batman wouldn't be as high up on the list, or even on the list at all, if he hadn't been steadily testosterone poisoned over the course of the Modern Age by people like Frank Miller. The Silver Age Batman was a much more cerebral character... although, yeah, he did occasionally do things like break the spine of a Great White Shark with the chain from the wrist and ankle fetters that the Joker had put on him right before tossing him into the shark tank. So I guess he was always pretty manly.<BR/><BR/>Back to Superman, while he's a paragon, he rarely exerts himself. I suppose he should get mad manliness points for the utter mind blowing mad macho bullshit stupidity he evinced in DEATH OF SUPERMAN, but I prefer to believe he was being mind controlled then.<BR/><BR/>The Superman from SUPERMAN II should probably be on the list, though, since he fucked Lois Lane and then robbed her memory of it, and returned to an obscure bar to get revenge on a bully after he got his powers back. But that's not the real Superman, either.Doc Nebulahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13052810933464744998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155196216983766562006-08-10T03:50:00.000-04:002006-08-10T03:50:00.000-04:00Um, ok. I realize I'm probably out of my league h...Um, ok. I realize I'm probably out of my league here. Still, how can Superman not be on the list of manliest men? He's the MAN of frigging STEEL, fer crying out loud!<BR/><BR/>Testosterone poisoning be damned!! Superman can drink raw plutonium and cleans his costume by flying through the sun. Not near the sun, THROUGH it.Natehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04492265703592804987noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155134989233944472006-08-09T10:49:00.000-04:002006-08-09T10:49:00.000-04:00Ag,The exact definition of a 'superhero' is someth...Ag,<BR/><BR/>The exact definition of a 'superhero' is something I'll probably do a post on the next time I get a few hours at a computer uninterrupted. Which with my life, could be never. But I've been musing on it.<BR/><BR/>http://martianvision.blogspot.com/2006/07/hey-kids-comics-part-i.html and http://martianvision.blogspot.com/2006/07/hey-kids-comics-part-ii.html are articles where I've detailed many of the elements of superhero mythology. However, all these are details and accoutrements, and are probably not all that essential... although I will say, for someone like Conan to be a 'superhero', certainly a distinctive costume/uniform and a secret identity would help get him there.<BR/><BR/>Still, what I think the essence of being a 'superhero' is, aside from cool sounding code names and costumes and all that other stuff, is that a superhero fights for an ideal. He is trying to accomplish something greater than himself, for selfless, altruistic reasons; trying to defend or protect others, generally strangers he has no personal interest in.<BR/><BR/>Conan gets into adventures, fights monsters, kills evil wizards, but he is always personally motivated. He doesn't care if the monster or evil wizard is preying on some remote mountain village; until he gets personally insulted, or wants to ball some chick who is being threatened, or someone offers to pay him, he's not interested. This, more than the lack of super powers (which Batman and Cap both also lack) or the lack of a costume (which Rorschach, and that awful Robinson Starman, both also lack) is why Conan can't be a superhero to me.<BR/><BR/>Now, I dislike the Punisher and I dislike Wolverine both as characters intensely; they embody, to me, the vast schism between Silver Age superheroics and what passes for such in the Modern Age... but both of them fight for something larger than themselves, and defend 'innocents', by which I mean, people they don't know and have no personal interest in. Like all Modern Age heroes, their motives are personal, often emotionally unhealthy, and never altruistic or noble, but, well, that's just the Modern Age for you. I'd call both 'superheroes', especially when you throw in the costumes and code names and (in Logan's case) superhuman abilities.<BR/><BR/>As to your list, I wanted to put Cyclops on mine, too, but then realized that in point of fact, I don't regard 'manly' as being particularly complimentary, and perhaps that's a mistake I was making, in trying to put all my favorite characters on the list. (I was also trying to shoehorn Hal Jordan onto it.) But suffering from excessive testosterone poisoning is never a positive trait; I just like Batman and Cap in spite of it.<BR/><BR/>However, I really should have found room for USAgent on my list. And, by the above definition of superhero, Nick Fury certainly qualifies, as well.Doc Nebulahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13052810933464744998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155131930230903702006-08-09T09:58:00.000-04:002006-08-09T09:58:00.000-04:00My pick for the "manliest" in no particular order:...My pick for the "manliest" in no particular order:<BR/><BR/>Captain America<BR/>Batman<BR/>Punisher (although neither a "hero" or "super" IMHO)<BR/>Luke Cage <BR/>Wolverine<BR/>Scott Summers/Cyclops<BR/>Hawkman<BR/>Ben Grimm (in either incarnation)<BR/>Robotman<BR/>Tony Stark/Iron Man (although I'm sure there a lot of folks who would disagree.)<BR/><BR/>I don't count "gods" such as Hercules or Thor, although I suppose testosterone levels in their vacinity are off the charts. <BR/><BR/>And Superman is sort of in a category of his own.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155067714683891852006-08-08T16:08:00.000-04:002006-08-08T16:08:00.000-04:00I'd count Swamp Thing as a superhero, although I g...I'd count Swamp Thing as a superhero, although I guess that's arguable. Still, I've called him a superhero before in a couple of my Martian Vision articles, albeit an occult one, so I'll stick with that.<BR/><BR/>Having said that, he's a walking mass of moss and rotting vegetation. Yeah, you fuck with his woman and he trashes all of Gotham City, and I respect that, but let's face it, anyone who has to have sex by eating hallucinogenic potatoes is lacking something in testosterone. Besides, he's way too reasonable to be manly. When's the last time he got in a fist fight with anyone? Nah. I'll still take Bruce and Steve.Doc Nebulahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13052810933464744998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18829500.post-1155066678559023452006-08-08T15:51:00.000-04:002006-08-08T15:51:00.000-04:00Holy metrosexual, Batman.But I guess it all depend...Holy metrosexual, Batman.<BR/><BR/>But I guess it all depends on your definition of manly.<BR/><BR/>Manly enough to decide it's not worth your time to kick someone's ass?<BR/><BR/>My vote? Swamp Thing. Yes, not quite a super hero, more like a vegetable, but he holds his ground, protects his woman and knows when to stop.Laurie Borishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08361627047571650547noreply@blogger.com